A couple of weeks ago, it was my one year anniversary with ERE Media and I’ve been doing a lot of thinking about online comments and online communities in general. When I accepted the role of Community Director, I didn’t expect the job to be easy. I expected it to be a challenge. The biggest thing that I didn’t anticipate though was how much my assumptions about online communities would shift over the course of a year. I also didn’t anticipate that it would still feel like progress has been, well, less than ideal.
I’m not a newbie to online communities. I mentioned at the Social Recruiting Summit last year that I have been involved with them since dial-in BBS’s were popular. When the web started to explode, I used IRC chat to discuss anything and everything. I created my own websites too and I bought my first domain name 12 years ago. I also had a fairly active account on LiveJournal (received 12k+ comments on my posts there and managed a big political community there). After that it was on to blogging, twitter and starting a blog/social network (mostly all in my professional realm).
The more I got into professional communities in the last year, the more I’ve doubted everything I thought. I know a major part of that is simply focusing in on the subject matter as a full time job rather than as a side job. Still, I am consistently humbled by how little actionable data I can use when making decisions or thinking of new ways of approaching a situation. Here is a sort of brain dump of what I’ve figured out and what I’m still struggling with.
Online Commenting
Let’s take the low hanging fruit here: online comments are going downhill quick. And that’s not an affront to people who comment here or on ERE Media sites (I would definitely rate the conversations here and there as much above average most of the time). If you go to most media sites though, the comments you find are often complete garbage.
Part of it is anonymity. It’s why we require people to use their real names on ERE.net. And I can’t lie that I’ve been watching how Techcrunch is handling using Facebook as their primary commenting platform. If I can be blazersguy1981 instead of Lance Haun, I don’t have to think that much about my comments. And indeed, when we’ve found people using aliases on ERE commenting on content there, we typically ask them whether they want to change their name and close their account (along with deleting all of the comments). Fascinatingly enough, most people ask for us to close their account.
I often wonder if there is another thing driving it though. Most comments have typically been disagreements with the post or adding something new but there was certainly a fair share of comments saying how they agreed with it or found it interesting. What we often see is people use Facebook or Twitter sharing as a way of saying that a post is interesting or that they agree with it. And when I’ve tracked my own behavior, I’ve noticed the same thing (sharing what I like or find interesting while commenting on things I disagreed with or had something to add). Comments used to be a real currency as far as how posts resonated with readers but now I focus a lot on how things are shared too.
Online Communities
Of course, one of the things I’ve also thought about is how communities continue to evolve. I think about the rapid expansion of online communities and I see much of it going to the top players in social networking: Facebook, Twitter and LinkedIn. So it seems like a necessity that if you run a brand, you should also be in those places (even if you have your own space).
As you can imagine, LinkedIn is by far the most successful at reaching our target demographic of recruiters. We have over 16,000 members in our group and pains have been taken to reduce the amount of spam and mindless promotions that typically overrun groups of this size. Our Twitter and Facebook accounts have less people but are still relatively popular.
The balance I’m always struggling with is how much time do we want to invest in something we have very little control over and something we do? Our LinkedIn group had some added functionality put into place that really helped moderation but that wasn’t done on any time schedule I could control. And if LinkedIn ever abandoned the concept or wanted to shut it down at some point, we’d have very little to say about that.
And while we do have our own community, there is a commitment there too. For one, building is tough and it is sort of like rolling out of the car lot in a brand new car. Very quickly, the stuff behind the scenes ages. I’m sure all of our friends who develop SaaS based tools can understand. You’re not only investing in the time it takes to develop the initial project but the time it takes to maintain and upgrade functionality in the future. Not only that, but you run against the grain of new people who are flocking to Facebook and little else.
Where Are We Going?
While anyone who has been around knows that things are on the constant move, I think there are some specific things that are happening:
- Anonymous is getting shoved out of the mainstream - There will always be places where the anonymous can roam around the internet but I have a feeling most of it will disappear from the mainstream content sites. Those that continue to allow comments will either find ways of verifying the poster or ensure that what an anonymous poster is posting adds to the conversation. At sites that want to continue using anonymous comments, they are going to shove them more out of the way or they will discontinue them entirely.
- Large social networks are reflecting real-life - The big plus about networks like Facebook, LinkedIn and Twitter is that, in all reality, they are millions of individual communities segmented in an ultra-personalized way. The people I follow on Facebook are different than anyone else. Features that continue to help users reflect that will prosper while others are likely short-lived.
- Smaller communities will have to sharpen their focus – Smaller communities play a vital role in this ecosystem but the focus has to be sharp and easy. With the many alternatives out there, smaller community operators have to be thinking about where they can continue to make a positive impact. Painful adjustments are going to be necessary but worthwhile.
- People are fickle, deal with it - If you saw the utter collapse of MySpace (really a blink of an eye), you should know that people are fickle. They are sensitive to a whole host of issues and if there are better alternatives out there, they’ll jump. Just look at the explosion Quora got at its launch. All of the Q&A sites are terrible and somebody upped the quality and people flocked to it. If spam and usability infest Quora, will it lose its mojo? Of course.
Where do you think online comments and community are going?

March 8, 2011 at 8:57 am
I very seldom comment on things that require me to register. Perhaps a bulletin board that has a discussion about a particular problem I’ve experienced, but that’s it. I’ve posted AC on Slashdot for 13 years and won’t ever create an account. The reason is just that I don’t care to spend the time at most sites, and because there is a big difference between making a civil and constructive comment – yet perhaps offhand or incomplete – and crafting a statement you don’t mind following you around for the rest of your life, and maybe well after that. We don’t have that happening in normal conversation, remember.
I think that sites could handle anonymous comments and spam much better and in a more automated fashion than they do. The easy thing is to shut it off. How often is the easy solution the right one? I’d rather be charged a few cents to post anonymously, if anyone would ever get micropayments sorted out, than to post under user accounts all the time.
March 8, 2011 at 4:28 pm
That’s the real balance. I figure that’s why many folks are using things like Facebook, Yahoo or Google as a login/identity platform. Eliminates that objection. But of course, there are a couple of issues with that too:
1. Single point of failure – All of your logins revolve around Google or Facebook accounts. If your account is compromised, the clean up process is messy.
2. Single company control – Google in particular keeps many of my services (including e-mail, blog statistics and RSS feeds) so Google knows a lot about me now.
As far as the bigger issue of something following you around the web, I guess I understand that. For me, I see much of the anonymous content not being great but it feels like we throw out the baby with the bathwater in a non-anonymous user only system. I’d love a system that allowed good anonymous comments but somehow easily killed the garbage that comes along with it.
Everything I’ve seen so far in this realm is less than ideal.
March 8, 2011 at 9:08 am
Super points Lance all around. Commenting, at least in masse, is seemingly only surviving on the most popular and/or controversial topics. Mostly now the sort of passive and low commitment retweet or ‘like’ substitutes for comment streams.
The other point you make about LinkedIn essentially holding the keys to a big part of your community is really on the mark. Whether it is a LinkedIn group, or a Facebook page, organizations investing so much of their time and efforts utilizing platforms that could either tank like mySpace, or start changing design, terms of use, functionality, etc. present a potential risk to the community builders. I think for organizations, not having all your community assets in one place might be a necessary risk mitigation strategy going forward.
March 8, 2011 at 4:15 pm
Right,and I really dislike that. Did people actually like this post or did they just never see it? Who knows. It feels more difficult to take the pulse on a post.
And I think you’re right about distributing your community. I see the mega LinkedIn groups and I’m not necessarily nervous for them but I wonder what the long term vision of that is? Probably taking it off LinkedIn.
March 8, 2011 at 2:41 pm
Seriously guys i think you need to go bush for a weekend at least, to brush out the cobwebs, Firstly lets keep it simple, Security i believe is probably your and everyone else’s with any brains greatest worry in this forum we call the Web –that should give you a clue—yep you probably never thought of this term in that context before but there it is. Wickileaks is not a joke and you are all aware of the ability of the Government computers and their propensity to encroach upon your life not only at a greater rate in your everyday lives but on the information or opinions you are professing, hence people not wanting to use their name even though when push comes to shove those using an alias can be tracked or found out with the software that is being developed or that already available. If u are spending as much time looking at the screen and are “genuinely interested” in what others have to say ” What do you really care if they don’t wish to tell you their name” , Grow up people, next you’ll want to know my age. and that just plain rude….
March 8, 2011 at 3:07 pm
Yeah, that’s no joke. It’s no longer tinfoil-hat territory to consider automated, pervasive government profiling and flagging of all domestic citizens when participating in Internet discussions. Instead it is naive to think that it *isn’t* happening. I would be shocked if there weren’t at least three completely independent, well-funded government projects accomplishing this very thing, and there might just as easily be three dozen. I’m not going to make it easy for them by linking every political opinion I’ve ever expressed to my Facebook account. And anyone wishing for a career in politics had better watch their online activity very carefully as well. Some of us aren’t ready to surrender all privacy yet – and anonymity is a strong form of privacy.
March 8, 2011 at 4:08 pm
I don’t disagree philosophically. Like I said, there will always be a place for anonymous people on the internet.
I just don’t think those people are going to be hanging out on mainstream news websites leaving comments or joining mainstream communities. If you want to be anonymous online, you probably aren’t starting very many accounts.
Could the US be monitoring all of the stupid comments being left on CNN.com? Sure. But in their current state, they are useless to everyone.
March 8, 2011 at 4:28 pm
Hm. One thing I realize as we discuss this is that there are certain kinds of things I don’t mind discussing “on the record”, and certain things that I decline to discuss except anonymously. That suggests something similar to what you are saying might happen – except that for me, major news sites top the list of places I normally demand anonymity, and for you they seem to top the list of places that will demand identities. I didn’t know there were any left that didn’t require accounts, and yet there is much inane, low-quality discussion still taking place there. CNN still allows anonymity? It must be one of the very few. Sometimes I check BugMeNot for an open account with which to post at a major news site, but most of them police for those accounts now. Washington Post, NYT, LA Times, Huffington Post, etc.
Now, a pet peeve you can probably agree with me on: sites wanting you to accept a Facebook *app* just to share or comment on an article. I certainly don’t ever do that.
As for what the future will look like, what of the vision that might already be taking shape on Facebook? I’m not talking about publishers requiring Facebook identities for commenting at the site of the article, but about people sharing the article on their wall and carrying on a discussion there, with their friends and acquaintances. That is now my primary method for discussing news and editorial material. Perhaps the dearth of civility and thoughtfulness on the publisher sites is not so much due to anonymity, as to the lack of any social ties between the participants? Or to the size and organization of the discussion? After all, half of the major sites don’t even have threading. That’s not even a conversation – more like a landfill for drive-by opinions, ascribable or no.
March 9, 2011 at 12:04 am
Comments and being anonym? Do we really think that everyone using a name is for real? Do we really believe that just because you have a gmail account its a real name? We have just raised the bar somewhat for the people wan ting to be anonymous on the net. And we have maybe forced them to use the same fake identity more than once. Thats all we have done. That I have a gmail account and a blog I have created using that email account means nothing. Not even that I have my own domain (no not .com its .se) means just that I can afford the price to pay for it. Do you really with 100% certainty know who I am?
Christian
March 9, 2011 at 10:15 am
I guess a person could argue it isn’t about using real names. It’s about dissuading unproductive and spammy conversations. Real names and account creation is one of those ways. Not the only way, not the perfect way, but a way. Reputation is another.
March 9, 2011 at 2:31 am
Interesting post.
I recently read an article that stated that companies and governments are using software to manage multiple profiles of “fake” users on online forums and social media sites such as facebook and twitter.
Also, the growth of companies to specialize in “social media management” also leads me to think that I cannot believe a lot of the profiles I see online.
Having said that, there are numerous resource online whose content and user base I trust.
I guess it comes down to the sites management, its up to a site to enforce certain rules that can ensure that the people posting are real people.
On sites where an opinion is the driver of the subject matter, there tends to me more fakes.
Its just an online equivalent of shilling, the age old technique of using herd mentality to convince people. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shill
March 9, 2011 at 10:20 am
There have been several high profile cases of shills. Again, using anonymous monikers that were eventually found out too.
March 9, 2011 at 12:11 pm
Do you have some examples ?
March 9, 2011 at 12:20 pm
The Whole Foods example is probably the best:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19718742/ns/business-consumer_news/
March 9, 2011 at 10:01 am
I benefit from comments on my blog — and it’s a weird thing because comments don’t mean traffic. I think that’s a great misconception in the marketplace.
March 9, 2011 at 10:22 am
I don’t think there is any doubt of the benefit of comments but you’re right that they don’t equate to traffic. Most of our highly trafficked articles aren’t the top comment getters.
There’s a benefit to conversation. Real conversation.
March 10, 2011 at 12:21 pm
This is a great post Lance. Reflective and authentic. This is one of the posts I’ll save and pass on to others. We are in a world of rapid change and serious discussion is hard to find. Opinions on the other hand are swamping cyberspace.
I especially like your response to Laurie noting that some of the most highly trafficked articles don’t necessarily generate the most comments.
I enjoyed and agree with much of what is said. The anonymity issue you described very well and is one I’ve had strong opinions about for quite awhile. As you note it is coming to a head as our values shift to greater transparency.
The thread here stimulates lots of interest in a deeper conversation and you might consider leading a discussion on this topic at ERE in San Diego. How about a rise and shine at 7am? I’ll be there if you do.
A couple issues are also bubbling up that fit your theme and I’ll mention one here. You spoke to the ‘major players’ – Facebook, Linkedin, Twitter etc. but most of us no longer actually ‘go’ to these individual sites as much as we did and instead scan the content or distribute content to them from 3rd party tools like hootsuite, tweetdeck or whatever is the current flavor of the week. We’ve downloaded these apps to our tablets, smartphones and computers, integrated everything via google or MS cloud components and still its not enough. These configurable toolkits are increasingly an important part of the process for filtering and organizing the useful stuff and discarding the crap.
And, by the way, great job at ERE. Like all your colleagues, you make David look smarter every year.